Summary
Trump announced plans to end birthright citizenship via executive action, despite its constitutional basis in the 14th Amendment.
He also outlined a mass deportation policy, starting with undocumented immigrants who committed crimes and potentially expanding to mixed-status families, who could face deportation as a unit.
Trump said he wants to avoid family separations but left the decision to families.
While doubling down on immigration restrictions, Trump expressed willingness to work with Democrats to create protections for Dreamers under DACA, citing their long-standing integration into U.S. society.
i wish everyone would get rid of the assumption that the constitution will protect you
“that’s unconstitutional!!!” doesn’t mean jack shit anymore
I’ve noticed many Americans also talk about those ‘unalienable rights’ like it’s some law of nature. They’re not unalienable. Having rights is not a given. Ask many groups of people throughout history. You only have rights as long as others respect them. Where are your unalienable rights when you’re grabbed off the street in a black van and taken somewhere without anyone knowing? When your fellow citizens / your government decides you shouldn’t have them anymore? If rights were unalienable, why are they dependent on borders?
Sometimes I think people feel too safe. Otherwise they wouldn’t accept others losing their rights so easily. They still think they won’t/can’t lose their own.
The constitution is more what you’d call “guidelines” than actual rules.
Every maga is downplaying his shit right now. “Not gonna happen” is what they all say.
They’ll deny it until it is happening and they feel safe to admit they believed him and wanted it to happen.
Yup. This exact shit has essentially destroyed my relationship with my parents. I can only ignore the repugnant politics for so long and up to a certain point before I have to reconsider if I want that hatred and bigotry in my life.
Yeah just like roe overturn didn’t happen 🙄
Anyone in the US who believes they have any sort of legal protection is just delusional. There only protection that exists there is through money.
deleted by creator
We’re going back to the “political spoils” system: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spoils_system
14th Amendment to the US Constitution
Section 1
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Let’s see how much the Constitution matters in a month and a half. Everyone who responds to the upcoming Trump madness with “it’s unconstitutional” are in for a rude awakening.
Yeah, it’s there, but as we’ve clearly seen, if the law isn’t enforced, or is selectively enforced, it might as well not exist.
Hell this exact amendment was openly ignored for nearly a century in that it is also meant to provide equality under the law for all citizens. But Women couldn’t even vote for decades after this amendment was passed. Then there were a ton of laws on the books that were actively enforced that discriminated on race, sex, etc. Women’s Suffrage and the Civil Rights Movement should not have been necessary after this amendment was passed. And yet…
DoJ: “My lord, is that… constitutional?”
SCOTUS: “I will make it constitutional”
Start by getting rid of Ted Cruz, Elon Musk, Vivek Ramaswamy, Melania and all the Trump kids.
Isn’t it crazy that only one person on that list is just a mere millionaire, the rest are billionaires?
Jr posted “Internet let’s do your thing, let’s find this guy” because he knew it was attack on his class.
If we want to Make America Great Again we needed to get rid of these parasites. They make us fight with each other, while they are the reason we get poorer and poorer.
Ate you saying Malaria is a billionaire?
It’s the same family.
14A S3 wasn’t enforced, why should 14A S1 be?
Because it wasn’t previously decided. However, in this case United States v. Wong Kim Ark (1898) is the Supreme Court ruling that determined the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution granted birthright citizenship to all persons born in the United States regardless of race or nationality.
In order to reverse, the court itself has to do it. Not that it wouldn’t.
deleted by creator
deleted by creator
If they’re not “subject to the jurisdiction”, doesn’t that mean they can just commit whatever crimes they want? Could they even be deported?
But that assumes the Republicans would be logical and consistent, when they are neither.
deleted by creator
which is probably gonna be that unauthorized immigrants are not “subject to the jurisdiction thereof”
From opening arguments podcast they said that was intended if say Mexico or Canada invaded, the soldiers bring their wives who give birth, then those kids are not subject to the jurisdiction of the US and not to be granted citizenship.
Of course lawyers can twist anything and scotus is rigged, so expect that.
deleted by creator
They are going to claim that if their patents are here illegally they aren’t ‘subject to the jurisdiction thereof’. No matter how stupid that idea is their supreme court may let it go anyway. They already shit all over other parts of the 14th.
Doesn’t saying they’re not “subject to jurisdiction” mean they’re outside general reach of the legal system, like a crime-drama character claiming diplomatic immunity?
I’d love to see someone pull that string.
Birthright. If you are born here, you are a citizen. That’s what they are talkin1g about.
There’s no confusion over the subject, just an expectation that the current SCOTUS could play the “Constitution doesn’t apply if the mother had no legal standing to actually be in the US” argument. That technically that hasn’t been established, and that there’s an implicit expectation that people giving birth in the US are legally recognized to be in the US, and all bets are off if the mother isn’t legally allowed in the US but gives birth in the US anyway. To the extent they seek being explicit about legal standing, they may point to the “and subject to the jurisdiction thereof” words as stating an illegal presence means that they are not subject to the jurisdiction of the US or the state.
deleted by creator
More likely, a lower court shoots it down, and there’s no basis for an appeals court to do anything different. They tweak it and try again. That one also fails. Try again.
Eventually, they get something that threads the needle. This is how the “Muslim ban” went.
deleted by creator
There are two other factors at work:
- A bunch of conservative-related businesses know what a clusterfuck it will be for their bottom line; that will push the Supreme Court to pretend there’s no issue here
- The Supreme Court can only take so many cases at a time
Even if we assume they’re just going to bypass the usual ladder up the federal court system, they can’t do that on everything just as a practical matter.
I concur with your interpretation. But as for your final line, I’m not sure why this interpretation is unfortunate. We need to streamline and overhaul the immigration process for sure, but why is encouraging unregulated immigration a good thing?
deleted by creator
Oh yeah, that’s definitely a bad outcome, I agree. Thankfully retroactive laws seem to be much harder to pass.
I enjoy the notion that they would argue that undocumented immigrants are not subject to US law in the fashion that diplomats aren’t subject to US law, since that would effectively prevent anything except deportation as a punishment for crimes.
“Your children can’t be citizens, but you can murder with impunity until we ask you to leave”.
Insanely unAmerican.
This is about as American as you can get.
Hate is a very American thing
Hate is in every country.
Ignorant take
Ok maga
This piece of shit is just trying to get rid of his wife and unattractive children.
Start with musk or stfu
Or barron
Musk doesn’t have birthright citizenship. As much as we wish he’d just go away, I hope you’re not suggesting they should expand this program to strip naturalized citizens.
Only thing naturalized about him is his bank account which is what has kept him off the icehouse list
He worked on a student visa after dropping school.
That’s illegal, so he shouldn’t have qualified for naturalization without correcting that and leaving the country before reapplying.
So you agree that he doesn’t have birthright status?
You’re barking up a tree that really doesn’t need it.
I feel like there should be a saying involving palm trees with this, as their bark is very different and they are actually closer to grasses than most trees.
Chop down a palm tree and count the rings to see how old it is, the answer is 0. They don’t make rings, much like a blade of grass. They are fn dinosaur grass basically. (They were around back then). It’s also part of how they can bend and not snap as easily during high winds.
She gets it
You understand the bark here is about a dog baying that they’ve treed an animal you’re hunting like a raccoon, but the raccoon isn’t in that tree, right?
Why would a raccoon chase a dog up a left tree? 🌴
Haha yeah, I get what the saying is about
He lied on his Visa papers and is literally an illegal immigrant.
Will be funny if they have a falling out and Trump rage enforces this against him.
They will inevitably have a falling out because they are both nepo baby idiots who can’t maintain long term relationships aside from sycophants and bootlickers.
That would literally be the single funniest thing that has ever happened in the history of mankind.
first idea of his that i dont find completely stupid
It’s only a core tenet of our country after all
as are guns. both are not necessarily beneficial
You have to have experience with a certain kind of person, in order to accept that they exist, in order to accept that weapons is the only way to deal with them, in order to get the second amendment.
It’s possible to think it through logically, but generally speaking people refuse to accept the existence of that kind of person, and refuse to let go of the idea that there may be some way to change the person’s intentions and choices without violence, so that neither party initiates violence.
The ultimate utility of weapons comes from that one kind of person, who just won’t pay heed to anything else. Until you’ve been forced to accept their existence in reality, the mind is just unwilling to entertain it.
what
TLDR: if you can’t conceive of a reason to need weapons it is because you have noy encountered a person for whom no other options exist to influencce their behavior.
that is some suggestive bs
You uh… okay with voiding parts of the Constitution with a vote in Congress? or Executive Order?
im not american, but if youre trying to justify a system where it is extremely difficult to change laws and rules that are outdated or no longer feasable, be my guest.
The entire reason they’re so hard to change is so they don’t get changed on a whim. If it’s in that document it’s because 3/4 of every elected representative in every state thought it was that important. Letting Congress change something like that with a simple majority or filibuster majority is ridiculous and means either party could completely re-write the basis of our laws at will just by changing that document. For example instead of trying to change and enforce every law about marriage and benefits they could simply pass a constitutional change to define marriage conservatively and let the courts go through striking down the now unconstitutional normal laws.
Making that document hard to change is one of the things America got right.
Why shouldn’t someone born in a country get citizenship regardless of who their parents are?
Why is punishing a child for what their parents did not completely stupid?
That’s some apartheid-level shit.
why is this a punishment? do you realize that if you are born on a vacation of your parents, this prevents you from getting citizenship. is this logical to you?
do you realize that if you are born on a vacation of your parents, this prevents you from getting citizenship.
That is absolutely false.
Latino men who voted for Trump right now:
😬
They still think it’s the illegals and their children.
Nah, they still think, “not me”
right until they get back to Habbanah, then they’re going to be “¿o no como puede seh que me lansan fuera de ehtadoh unidoh?”
They don’t know Spanish.
It primarily attracted members from the anticommunist middle class, small business owners, self-employed professionals such as physicians and lawyers, national conservatives, and nationalist World War I veterans, many of whom believed that Nazi antisemitism was only a rhetorical tool used to “stir up the masses.”
Wow, uncannily familiar.
Any person familiar with the rise of Nazi Germany in the 1930s has been absolutely terrified for at least a decade now.
Things that aren’t possible, at least under current legal frameworks.
I know that laws are only as good as they’re enforced and all but barring wholesale collapse I find it hard to see Donny pulling that off.
It is absolutely possible under America’s legal framework. Mackenzie v Hare was the 1915 Supreme Court case, which ruled that a natural-born U.S. citizen woman could lose her citizenship by marrying a non-citizen man.
The holding functionally stood until 1967, when there was a case called Afroyim v. Rusk, where the court held that natural born citizens cannot be stripped of their citizenship involuntarily. But that was a 5-4 decision in the Warren Court, in many regards, the most liberal supreme court in history. A decision that barely won a majority in a court drastically more liberal than this one is what’s standing between today and a world where natural born citizens can have their citizenship deemed forfeit.
I’m cool with brain drain – if this actually happens a nice European country will happily open their doors to the educated (see Ireland, Spain already) and america will further collapse like it should.
I think there is a specific “class” of people they’re going to target.
Who could have possibly seen this coming?
Not sure how he plans on deporting people who were born in the United States and have no citizenship anywhere else since not every country automatically gives it to people’s children born abroad.
They would effectively have no home country to deport them too.
He doesn’t plan on shit. Even this Supreme Court would tell him to fuck off.
Given that the Supreme Court ruled that all official (who decides?) acts are legal, I have no faith in them.
You are missing out on a key component of their plan: concentration camps.
He has outright said that he plans on using the same law that was used to justify the internment of Japanese citizens during WW2.
Literal concentration camps are coming.
Meaning they will stay in the concentration camps until Trump’s Final Solution is implemented.
Slavery is much more economically viable than extermination. So, thank you capitalism, I think?
But you also have to keep slaves relatively healthy to maintain them working. If you slaves get too hungry, they can’t do whatever labor you make em do. If they get real sick, it’s going to affect your other slaves.
And human slaves usually don’t put their heads down and do it forever. A lot of the Nazi labor camps massacred their captives because they started uprisings.
There is nothing economically feasible with what they want. They just think they can do what they want and he even richer. Which is why you can look at the entirety of recorded human history for these same mistakes being repeated over and over again.
That’s easy, you just continue to expand the list “undesirables”.
They also don’t seem to know or tend to forget that it only needs a relatively small percentage of the population to flat out resist for society to stop working. Only a few hundreds of thousands of protesters in East Germany brought the country to its knees and effectively ended the Cold War.
A “Fine ol’ solution” as they say in Florida
I should invest in corrections, sounds like a goldmine
They would effectively become stateless. And how they do what from there depends a lot on where they are forcefully relocated to. Assuming the majority will be forced into Mexico, Mexico has an established legal process for accepting refugees. Through the application process, if approved, you (and your family unit) would gain permanent residency. It’s not the same as citizenship, but you could stay there indefinitely and have mostly the same rights as Mexican citizens. You might run into issues with getting passports and traveling internationally, but at the least, you would be able to stay in Mexico. That depends on your refugee application being approved, and I’d imagine when the numbers cross over into the millions their established system would break down a bit and there would probably be very long delays during which you could be deported.
If it’s somewhere else, well, it varies widely. Most of the Caribbean islands have comparatively smaller populations and probably only handle migration on a small scale. It’s very hard to say how things would play out. Many would almost certainly be forced to illegally immigrate back into America.
He was already shocked Honduras(?) turned down his “offer” to send them deported people. I think it’s only a matter of time before they send a plane somewhere anyhow and get US flights promptly everywhere.
That didn’t stop them from deporting people to Mexico in the 30s. A senator at the time estimated that 60% of those who were removed from the country were US Citizens
Even bigger question: what then?
Say you deport a citizen of Mexican origin to Mexico. Can’t they just, you know, go back? They’re citizens, with a passport/id.
The only alternative is to strip them (at least de facto) of their citizenship, which is literally a Hitler move (https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gesetz_über_den_Widerruf_von_Einbürgerungen_und_die_Aberkennung_der_deutschen_Staatsangehörigkeit, only a German source, unfortunately).
You don’t even need to read the article. The title states quite clearly this is about citizenship not residence.
Yes they’ll have to revoke citizenship.
Which may be the end goal, use this as a wedge to convince their base that revoking citizenship may be justified in some cases.
Happened to my grandfather. A Jew born in Germany who emigrated to England in the late 1920s. I have his naturalisation papers from when he became a citizen of the UK in 1936 and his nationality is listed as “stateless.”
Hello. Australian here. Just ask our sadistic government. We do it all the time. Hint: It involves putting people in camps.
Little camps for homework. Where you can concentrate.
I’m a bit conflicted in this, because Canada has similar issues with this but it’s more “birth tourism” where people from various other countries come here for a limited time - have a child who is entitled to citizenship and all the benefits - and then leave. That child spend decades never setting foot in the country, but still be eligible for a passport, voting rights, and many other such things despite having no significant ties to the country, and neither parent being a citizen
How is this an issue? How many people do you honestly go abroad explicitly to give birth there to gain the system?
Sounds like you fell for yet another outrage clickbait. If 100 people do this, whatever. I rather have this than someone being born in a country and lives there their entire life but has no right of nationality there because their parents weren’t there for 5 years prior to their birth or whatever the fuck the law says.
UK has no citizenship by birth type and it hurts way more people than could ever hope to abuse it.
I looked it up there were 3,575 non-citizen births in Canada in 2023.
I couldn’t find any numbers on how many were deliberate
That’s also not counting the # of people that try and fail.
Border services can turn back people who are pregnant and close to their end-date
So less than 1% of natural born Canadian citizens in 2023 were to non-citizen parents? Really send like it’s not that big of a deal at all
If someone uproots their life to go and live in a different country and contribute paying more taxes than average family with zero safety nets? They earned it.
People love to act like immigrants have it somehow easier… While they’re heavily discriminated at every step, pay extra for just about everything and come with less money moving in, no family house to fall back onto etc. The entitlement I’ve seen in my life disgusts me.
It’s “game the system” just so you know.
Ah yes, the “outrage clickbait” that is a known issue and has been the subject of numerous studies by government and reputable institutions both pre and post pandemic.
Guess we should send the border services agency a memo that it’s probably only a hundred people and they should remove it from the things they literally screen for, because some Internet genius is sure it’s nothing to worry about…
That would technically be everyone though? All Americans are descendant from immigrants.
Native Americans and Hawaiians aren’t immigrants.
“Doesn’t the 14th Amendment pose a problem for that plan?”
“Not a problem, no one handles amendments like me. 14 amendments is nothing, when I…when I do the Christ stuff before food I do 15, 30, 100 amendments. And people say ‘Wow, you are so good with the amendments, no one does the amendments like you.’ So I got that all taken care of.”The Supreme Court in historically (and I can only imagine the current court will be the worst so far) has never been able to count to 14 much less interperate it.
He actually already opened an office to review and attempt to take away citizenship from people who already earned it, back in 2020.
