Hi! In thinking about how to help the fediverse grow, I wonder if there are more mainstream Lemmy instances?
I’ve pointed a couple folks to Lemmy.world and it’s uhhh, pretty hard Left for them (as one girl, who volunteered for the Democrats said “I just got yelled at because I can’t be Left wing unless I want to destroy capitalism? Which feels weird.”) We’re much farther Left than reddit which itself was definitely Left of centre…
I don’t know if decentralized open source social media actually attracts many mainstreamers but assuming we want to grow the fediverse, I’d like to have somewhere I can point people to without feeling very nervous for them.
Thanks!
Reddit was only ever left of center for Americans. To many/most non Americans, America consists of a far right party and a center to center right party.
What you’re seeing is the result of a platform that wasn’t first created by and for American audiences, and whose initial takeup wasn’t dominated by American perspectives.
I’m not American.
Lemmy is much farther left than any of our national discourse.
I get that American parties are farther Right than most but the discourse here is much farther Left than almost all political discourse. Edit: I’m happy to be corrected, show me a serious party in a position of power in a Western democracy committed to ending capitalism!
I’m not saying that if you don’t want to destroy capitalism that you’re not left. I’m saying that the perspective that reddit itself was “definitely left of center” is not a widely shared perspective, and if you believe that reddit of all places was left of center, then lemmy, which actually is left of center, is going to feel very left of center.
I’d strongly disagree. I think reddit is generally on the left side of most cultural and political institutions.
To each their own though.
Then honestly you must live in some radically conservative country.
Canada.
No mainstream party suggests UBI as a matter of principle for example.
I don’t think that UBI is the predominant reddit viewpoint either - I think that’s just the subs you’re in.
I’m Canadian too, and I certainly don’t consider reddit as left of center on average. It’s almost like 4chan lite.
But on that note, if you’re looking for Canadian instances, there are a few good ones.
The obvious one is lemmy.ca, but the other (bigger?) one is sh.itjust.works which is bilingual and I think is québécois.
Presumably a Canadian instance would have relatively Canadian political leanings, although as has been said before, instance doesn’t really matter.So basically the same as America but behind by 18 months then politically?
Our overton window is only a few degrees to the left of the US.
Also the Ontario Liberals conducted a UBI pilot in Hamilton during the 2010s with the goal of proposing some form of it as a policy if results were positive.
Then there’s been the UBI experiment in Manitoba during the 70s.
There it is.
Your “country” is a collection of mining and timber companies in a trench coat.
Who is much more left wing than Canada?
Is hating for profit healthcare a leftist ideology?
I agree that most of Lemmy is rather cynical and very far lest
Agreed. I got lost at ‘Reddit is left…’
Huh?Until r/TheDonald you wouldn’t really see right wing concepts on the frontpage.
I distinctly remember liberal messages rising to the top on Reddit, stuff like that you should just accept that you have to go out and work for a living. That’s not left!
10s of millions of “left wing” (read, the entire spectrum from center to marx) folks believe that, for better or worse.
That opinion is entirely valid as “left wing” but certainly isn’t very left, on an absolute scale.
I disagree. Having some kind of grievance with capitalism an sich is central to being leftwing.
If left-wing covers all concepts left of center, and many mild left policy still incorporates capitalism, then it can’t be reduced that strictly. I could agree that progressive or far left policy isn’t compatible with capitalism
Edit either way, we disagree on semantics. It’s off topic for the original question now (I’m not sticking that on you, I contributed to this semantic rabbit hole)
To circle it back, I think there’s a way to invite “normies”, maintain left leaning (even very left leaning) positions, and not compromise the platform.
Edit edit and I think that’s possible without purity testing or shotgunning people with theory
No I don’t agree with that at all. You see right-wing Concepts all the time if you know where to look for them. Anytime there’s any discussion of protests? Comment section is militantly right-wing. Reddit gets hard that idea of running over and killing protesters. Anytime there’s anything about criminal justice? Nothing a redditor loves more than the idea of locking people up and torturing them. And don’t get me started on any video game subreddit.
Pre 2016 reddit front page was not as you describe. I’m not saying it was perfect, I’m saying open conservative concepts were not prevalent or popular.
Strong disagree.
Ok
deleted by creator
Imperialism isn’t unique to right wing
The world is a hugely diverse place that doesn’t easily fit into a left or right category from the perspective of politics in an individual country. While I agree that the US is a conservative country, this narrative is a bit exaggerated. The median global opinion on various issues would be all over the place from a US perspective, from far right to far left or even defying any categorization. As a result saying that the US is to the right of most of the rest of the world is a huge oversimplification.
The US has a nazi sympathising president, backed by a billionaire who gives nazi salutes in public. So I don’t agree that saying the US is to the right of most of the world is incorrect.
Well, there is a distinction between the the leadership and the populace. The context here was about the populace, since that is who is participating in these online conversations. I agree with you that the current government is an extreme right one. And yes many people did vote for this but I suspect many do not support his full agenda, they were just fooled into thinking this was the least bad option.
A nazi sympathising president was voted in, because the overton window has shifted sufficiently to the right to allow that to happen.
Fediverse is anticapitalism at its core, it’s a way to escape ads and money influencing algorithims and what can be said. If you don’t like power to the people, join truth.social or some other unfederated instance.
My impression is that Lemmy and the fediverse are a manifestation of the dissatisfaction with the current “normal” and “mainstream” social media platforms which are in decline due to hyper-capitalism. Is it no wonder the majority of its users’ ideology doesn’t align with what is “normal” and “mainstream”?
That being said, this system is designed so that communities can exist independently from one-another. You’re always welcome to create your own. Otherwise, lemmy.world is just about as “normal” as you’re going to get out of Lemmy.
I dunno… I admittedly live in a fairly liberal city in Canada but in casual conversation with all sorts of folks (I play soccer on 4 teams so have a pretty wild cross section of friends) I’ve heard lots of grumbles. Heck, a couple songs ago a random Tidal playlist song was groussing about the algorithms.
Even reddit had a bunch of grumbles and complaints and people looking for alternatives though I admittedly rarely look there anymore.
The worst enemy of a leftie are other slightly different lefties lol
The good think of federation is that you can mute/block morons. And because there’s no “algorithm” you are not shown content that the server thinks you are interested. So you have to be proactive and follow what you want to see, and mute the ones you dislike.
Also, you can have multiple accounts for multiple purposes. It’s sane not to discuss politics with other people from other cultures all day, so you can have a dedicated account for that. And other account to have fun in a sane way, which includes muting politics.
In the case of this girl, she was american like the majority of lemmings I believe. But for people from the other hemisphere, the cultural shock may be even worse. My advice for those is always: Just mute. Don’t argue and don’t feed trolls. Nobody is gonna change opinions anyways.
I feel like she wasn’t told to use the block feature freely and deliberately. The block feature is your friend.
Lemmy is different from Reddit in one important way.
Reddit is a product. You install the app, you look at the ads, the mods and admins curate an endless feed of cartoons and safe ragebait and awwwunexpectedsmiles.
Lemmy is an environment. If you’re passive, then any random thing may happen to you. So you have to be proactive in this environment.
- You could subscribe to communities that are non-politics/news, non-meme, non-tech, and browse these “subscribed” communities.
- You could use blocklists, as described elsewhere in this post.
- You could find an instance that does some of this work for you, by defederating and blocking certain types of opinions and behaviors. This seems to be what you want, and many people have provided suggestions.
These are all ok. But the one defining characteristic of Lemmy is that it is not just another product.
Mods please install an upvote twice button.
Yes, I agree. Most people in the US are definitely not Marxist-Leninist, yet that’s a vibe i get here frequently.
A more mainstream instance for normal people would be nice. Maybe there should be a non-profit organization behind it to back it up, pay the server bills, and such.
The USA is neither mainstream nor normal.
It’s a literal fascist shithole.
President Musk is doing nazi salutes on live television and anyone calling him right of centre gets labelled as a communist and a terrorist.
No one who isn’t a fascist wants that kind of shit to be considered mainstream or normal.
Lemmy.world is considered the “normie” instance. Even if you manage to find another instance, it won’t matter that much anyway since most interactions are from federated users. The only way to avoid leftist views on Lemmy is to avoid politics completely (which isn’t viable).
Many people block all political communities and keywords. It’s definitely viable.
If you block political words and Linux this place is a ghost town…
… Except for LotR memes of course.
Linux
Linux isn’t politics. :(
i use arch, btw.
Linux isn’t politics
A wild Richard Stallman has appeared!
I can understand blocking political words, but Linux? You might as well browse 9gag at that point.
deleted by creator
So if you can’t handle that there are other opinions, you either need to find the communities which support your opinions or go back to corporate internet, which filters out uncomfortable stuff for you.
Corporate internet doesn’t even filter out “uncomfortable” shit for people. They have a vested interest in keeping people engaged whether it’s through love or hate.
This is a misconception I see all the time. Reddit et al try their hardest to make browsing feel like a roller coaster to keep up engagement.
… or clone the software and host it yourself.
Lol @ “who volunteered for the Democrats”. Ain’t that a microcosm of every American politico (especially Democrats) ignorant of actual political theory.
Imagine getting upset that someone accurately described “leftism” to you. I can only imagine it’s major cognitive dissonance after a lifetime of consuming mainstream political media calling liberalism “leftist” and pushing the overton window right.
Lemmy.world already is the “normie” instance catering to liberalism. Your friend either ran into the more progressive parts of that instance or an actual leftist from a federated one. Either way, they got told an accurate take.
Anyway, can we please stop all the attempts to make this place comfortable for conservative and right wing views in the name of “growth”? Have y’all actually been on a default subreddit in the last 15 years? Would that be worth it here?
Your last point is what really resonates with me. I’ll take Marxist-Lenninists all day over stupid right wingers who created this whole fucking mess. At the very least, the former read books. The latter only know how to kiss ass.
Im not sure all the Marxist read books but theor heart tends to be in a better place
Imagine that, someone using words as most people use them! Wild!
Like, do you write to all newspapers when they talk about the Left Right divide and complain that the Dems aren’t Left because they don’t want to destroy capitalism?
What a weird existence you must have, almost all popular discourse just goes right over your head or what?
Nah, I just find amusement in someone who ostensibly considers themselves political (volunteers for the Dems!) being affronted when accurately told that being leftist entails more than what talk about on NPR and NYT. Even the Wikipedia summary of leftism states the modern left is anti-capitalist and liberalism is “center-left” at best. It’s just an example of the allowed spectrum of opinion and an example of how much the politico class ignores political theory outside that spectrum.
And we push back on it because allowing the right wing, mainstream media, and liberal parties to define liberalism as the left is exactly what helps push the Overton window to the right.
Instead of running away when confronted with that fact and creating a space for centrists to feel more comfortable, maybe y’all could listen instead.
Hey you’re doing the thing
what thing?
Good
I seriously doubt most normies would enjoy Lemmy. But sh.itjust.works seems pretty middle of the road.
It’s good!
Thanks, I’ll check it out!
I just love the idea of non corpo social media but to get the network effects to scale we need the normies…!
Lemm.ee was specifically created during the reddit exodus as a way to manage the influx and is very loosey goosey. Unfortunately that means you have to block the horrible instances manually, but it is what you’re looking for I believe
Very true, we need everyone to be open minded. Both those on the platform but also those coming in. I hope the comunity can keep the discourse constructive. Hope you can enjoy the platform!
I’m like your friend. F— leftists and f— conservatives. I’m a hard core liberal and y’all can suck my d—.
I find lemm.ee is better than most but yeah as others have said, since everything is federated and the majority mass of users are hardcore leftists there’s no way to really avoid them. Just get used to the downvotes and easily offended snowflakes and instabans and hope that as more people leave the mainstream social medias for federated socials that these people will be watered down.
There are tens of us already!
Lemmy.world is pretty moderate left wing, your Democrat volunteering friend sounds like a crypto conservative.
I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but global politics have taken a nasty turn, and mincing words to appease the appeasers tends to end in a “and then they came for me” scenario.
Instead of finding a milquetoast community where you can trade lukewarm takes while Reichstag burns to the ground, why not try to engage with people you might not see eye to eye, but may broaden your horizons and even change some of your attitudes.
Wouldn’t really make much of a difference in what server you choose, if the goal is to get “away” from Lemmy.world. The majority of users is from there.
Maybe it’s not the server, but more the community that’s an issue for you?
Please join a small instance. Lemmy doesn’t work if people don’t spread out. Just choose some small instance that seems chill. You can search and sub to any community. It really makes no difference.
Until the admin of a small instance decides to randomly leave the project one day and your account is gone forever. I’ve seen it happen multiple times and it’s why I go for bigger or at the very least, long standing instances.
But an account means nothing, just make a new one on an instance that also aligns with your expectations
Well then idk what to say. Lemmy and the fediverse is a failed experiment. I mean what’s the point if people just congregate into one huge instance? Kinda defeats the purpose, no?
I mean, there are still multiple large and/or long standing instances out there. It’s not like there is only a single one of them. I would just generally encourage people to utilize those instead. And if they choose a smaller instance that they should be aware of the risks.
If smaller instances aren’t stable or practical then this is a failed experiment. End of story.